Had some thoughts today and i wrote this over at SMC and I thought I'd share it here too. :) Coz i think less than 7 person is going to finishing this LONG post and it's a waste coz i did spend A LONG TIME writing it! :lol:
Anyway, here goes:


When I first started my interest in magic, there were no such thing as "Street Magic". It is true that this term is only popularly coined after David Blaine's TV specials. That's why you wouldn't hear old foggies refer to themselves as street magicians, unless they are street buskers. ;)

Now, for the longest time, to me, Street Magic just means Close Up Magic, and I came to accept the term as something the MTV generation needs for "re-branding" magic tricks to make it cool again. B)

But now, I'm thinking otherwise. And here's why...

If you ask anyone who started magic in the last 5 years who are the street magic icon magicians. They will inevitably say David Blaine, Criss Angel, and the latest poster boy Cyril Takayama.
Now, if you REALLY think about it, are these close up magicians? Actually, not really!

Maybe what David Blaine did in the VERY beginning can be considered Close up effects. But very quickly, the effects start to get very different from close up stuff. They become very elaborated effects.
Likewise with Criss Angel and Cyril, their effects take a ridiculously amount of effort to set up and prepare that it is very impractical for the traditional closeup magician.
Think about all the ripping out heart, and swallowing coin and cutting it out of the arm, and the various versions of levitations, and selected card inside basketball, and burgers from walls and etc etc. All of these needs very elaborated setup and resources and very carefully controlled audience angles. Even things like the snap change isn't really pratical for the traditional closeup magician (at least not the way it was done by Blaine) because of the angles issues.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but most (not all) of these effects are specifically designed for TV (controlled angles) and can only be performed in real life to very limited number of people (3 at most).
Or requires too much set up to be worth just performing once.
These are effects that are NOT preferred by the close up magicians who probably does strolling or restuarant gigs.

Another characteristic of these street magician's performance is the focus on the spectator rather than the magic itself. Yes, a lot of the effects are stunning, but if you compare the screen-time, A LOT of footage is spent on the spectators' reaction rather than on the magic itself. It's almost like the spectators are the main star rather than the magician. This is not like tradition close up magic performance at all.

Now, magic on TV is nothing new at all. Before street magic comes into existance, there were PLENTLY of (really big names like McBride and Lance Burton) magicians who performed on TV, and many of them did closeup/parlor stuff sometimes too.
But these TV specials did not even come near the penetration rate to layman of these "Street Magicians" has now.
With possibly the expection of David Copperfield. Why?

I think it's because of the effects performed. For the TV special of that time, the effects were stuff that the magicians do in real life performances. These are effects that are BEST suitable for real life performances, when you can really feel the impact, and on TV, it just lose the oomph.
It's like theater drama or dance. When you watch them live, they can be really really powerful and can easily move people to tears. But if you watch it on TV, it can look really cheesy or boring.
To present theater drama successfully for TV (or movies for the matter). It has to be "re-invented". It needs very specific treatments not in theater like cinematography and editing and special effects.
And at the same time, remove a lot of elements of traditional theater, like the exaggerated acting and the big actions and the use of colourful props.
This "re-invention" is to the point that it is not longer theater acting but becomes a different genre of drama; TV and movies.

That is what I am saying. That "Street Magic" is an evolution of TV magic plus close up magic. And it is different enough from traditional TV magic specials and close up magic and has skill/techniques unique to it to be considered a genre by itself.
This is a genre of magic effects that are very visually stunning, and possibly difficult to duplicate in live shows.
And this is a genre of magic performance style that is very different from traditional live shows and specifically suited for the camera/TV.

However, this means that the term "Street Magic" is very misleading. It probably should be termed as "TV Magic" or "Camera Magic" to accurately describes it as a genre. :unsure:



Anyways, that's my thoughts. Comments from any of you 7 persons? B)


P.S. Errr....so by my reasoning, does that mean people who call themselves street magicians but hasn't done any filming (either for TV or private projects) are like people who call themselves movie actor but has never acted for any film projects(commercial or independent)? :P

Although its billed as so,I don't think the stuff you see on TV is actually street magic, except maybe Mondo Magic and maybe some of Blaine's 1st and 2nd TV show.

I havent seen much of Cyril's magic to comment.

Aloy, Basically 'Street Magic' is another marketing trend business investors make big money from the TV stations. These investors or big businesses are the ones that make the money - not the performers (unless the performers own the business).

You can't just go around the streets and perform good magic and be rich. No one will pay you - even the tips you get may be peanuts. No one can earn a living from street magic or busking.

So as a product - the production show - TV and Camera angles can bring out the show (not the magic) favorably and to do so many audience angles are taken into consideration. The current trend today is reality shows and that means focusing on the people's reactions.

Street magic is a marketing gimmick for promotions and publicity. If you do it for that purpose then proper strategies needs to be developed - that means immediately after the event - the market/people must show an interest in your product/service and want to pay for it immediately. You get more shows, more lectures, etc.

Bear in mind that these street performance events do not have long term impact - people will be drown by other advertisements and forget about what they saw.

That is why TV media is used today. You air it every week so people will see you frequently and will continue to talk about you. This is essentially BIG BOYS Marketing game. Ask yourself who is behind the Mondos Boys?

In the world of business - if you can give your product a unique twist and you are different from the rest and if you are THE FIRST in offering this idea you will make it - provided you have BIG BOYS behind you.

The next performer from today onwards that want to use street magic in the TV media - will not make it. Why? The idea is already stale.

It is all in the dollars and cents. The macro view of the magic entertainment industry.

Aloy, This sound interesting. This is cool.

Jeff Gan, I think Cyril short clip are a lot which fly over internet. [I don't think you can buy those clip because these show are show only in japan, what you can get is only 3 DVD which is very very little show compare to the clips fly over internet.]

I confuse myself "Is camera trick one of the magic trick?"

*For my personal opinion don't point out if I am wrong, give your opinion I will correct myself if you are correct. *

*Think of Blaine's Levitation when you continue*
I think it's really hard if you want to do a magic camera trick, this trick credit to magician or the camera man? I will credit to both of them. The magician do the show, the camera man give the show a BOOM!! and amaze people. Camera man are a magician's asistant in this part. I think assistant take part for some of the magic illusion will give the show.*

*Think of Penn and Teller - Off the Deep End [This TV magic show "Vanished an 8 tons submarine underwater skip this if you didn't watch this show]
A camera trick routine create by the magician, the magician tell the camera man what to do. This routine give the show a BOOM!!*

*Think of Cyril 3 DVD Series [Skip this if you didn't watch it and will be shorter]
I never get boring when watching these shows. The showmanship of Cyril are good. After watching the show really improve the showmanship I have [again I am not a magician, I found interested in magic]*

*Before you continue, open your mouth, show your tongue, and touch your left ear.
I can confirm most of us can do it.*

*Think of Derren Brown Mentalism Series [Trick of Mind, The Heist, The Gathering and a lot more, skip this if you didn't watch it, watching magic show learn the showmanship and knowning the secret and just for a new illusion but I definately will not visit a magicshow from long distance]
The best part Derren Brown do to me is let me keep on rewatching his video.
I had nothing to said on him, showmanship very strong and how he did what I mean is the secret I had no idea I cannot find his "keyword".*

"What a Video?" I think there is a lot of answer.
"Can watch in TV." "Join a m1v and mp2 can make a video."

"What is street magic?" "What is magic?"
When I have no idea on something, what I do is visit www.wikipedia.com see what others said about it.

After I finished what I think "I wrote too much rubbish." :P
And sorry wasting your time.

From a professional point of view indeed :)

But my post was a little more philosophical actually.

My question is:
The type of magic that is generally termed as "Street Magic", is it different enough from traditional close-up to be considered a genre of it's own?

Magic on TV is nothing new. I remember watching Blackstone on TV when i was just a weeny bit, and religiously taping every single episode of World's Greatest Magic when I was still in Primary school way before I could name any of the performers. B)

But my pondering is this:
Why hasn't it has such a far reaching impact before as it does now? (Exception being David Copperfield. Even my MOM knows Copperfield)
Is it because a different type of magic performed differently is shown on TV now?

And, is it different enough to be considered a genre of magic by itself, e.g "Camera Magic"? As opposed to just calling it Close Up done on TV.


Cheers

I think its the publicity machine which made Copperfield so famous.

He used the Malaysian mentality of must be the biggest (check out our malaysian book of records for the longest Popiah or highest teh tarik which we are so proud of :P ) <_<

the statue of liberty and great wall stuff were great publicity stunts. not to mention expensive. not to mention the red tape involved in pulling off the stunts. but they paid off for him.

btw, my whole post is off topic.

i consider street magic a new genre and i agree what Aloy have said to a large extend

there were close-up magicians, stage magicians, mentalist and soon there will be street magicians who only do effects that's suitable for TV/camera only
as for those who call themselves "street magicians" are most probarbly those David blaine wannable/ they are just new to magic.
personally, i see street magic as TV magic showing a magician impress people on the street. And i see it as something good, as a close-up worker might be thinking of ways to make the "street magic effects" more practical :D

Jeuze,

whats Penn & Teller and Derren Brown got to do with street magic or close up magic ?

Aloy is asking is today's so called street magic actually close up magic in a new packaging or is it a different category of its own?

Street magic has already been in history for some time - you can see them not only in USA but also all around China and of course in Europe too.

There are two types of street magic - small scale (busking) and commercially big time (David Blaine).

It is because of technology - TV Media that more people know about it today.

Basically street magic is a combination of close-up and parlour magic which is no different than magic perfomed in a children party show.

When the performance venue changes people would have a different perception on it. And along with the marketing 'salt' and 'pepper' seasoning it - people would view it even more differently.

Let us not deviate from the fundamental principles of magic. Being aware of the trend is good but following the trend is not healthy.

At the end of the day - it is YOU that people must remember, recognise and respect.

I am a very practical person in professional magic - I am very focus on the ultimate goal - I do not want people to say - hey I saw a magician (me) performing and he does tricks like David Blaine, or the Mondo Magic boys. I want people to remember me and not only my magic.

We must see things from a macro view - including our personal life - and what we want to get out of it from being a magician.

There is no end in discussing things from a philosophical view - because no one is wrong. It is a fact.

What is it that you want to get out of life from magic (rewards - may not necessarily means money)? How do you want magic to bless your life?

Food for thoughts, right?

Jeff Gan, Wah~, take me time to think "Am I misleading myself?"

*Derren Brown most his show are mentalism or completely mentalism magic?
01. Where Derren perform his show?
02. On street or somewhere else, stage?
03. Where you see his show? TV or computer?
04. Did Derren mention he do mentalism or close up or street magic to the audience? [e.g Trick of Mind, Mind Control or Russian Roulette .....]?
If Derren's show nothing to do with street magic or close-up so you can skip.
Or I just misleading myself.*

*David Blaine [Street Magic, MagicMan, Vertigo, Frozen In Time]
01. Did Blain do mentalism on street?
02. Since when Blaine said he do street magic only first TV show name "Street Magic"?
03. Where you watch? TV or computer?

*Penn and Teller: Off the Deep End [This is the hard part hard to explain]
01. The whole video are underwater magic show, really no close up at all, so nothing to do with street magic or close up? then you can skip it.
Am I misleading myself, but I did watch they do close up on beach in this show [This part if Blain or Criss Angel is the performer then only group or catogorised as street magic or close up?].
02. They said most of the magic take place underwater, didn't they?
03. Where you watch? TV or computer? Maybe real life?

*Criss Angel: Mindfreak [This show really freak my mind]
01. Where Criss perform his show? Street?
02. Since when Criss said he do street magic? Am I misleading myself again?
03. Where you watch? agian TV or computer?

*Cyril [DVD name "Cyril Super Street Magic Magazine Part I, Part II, Part III"]
01. Where Cyril perform his show? Street?
02. Speak in Japanese, no idea did Cyril said he do street magic.
03. Where you watch? TV or computer?
PART III of cyril, I didn't see a single street on the show [Bar Magic, Close Up, Prediction, Card .... ] but the name really misleading.

Aloy's question really cool, can answer different point of view, that why I mention you can skip.

James point of view are in business...no really sure so if I misunderstand.

Aloy: "Is Street Magic A Genre?, Or is it just Close Up with a new name?"
I think Aloy had his answer. [Asking a question which had answer?].

Jeff Gan: "Aloy is asking is today's so called street magic actually close up magic in a new packaging or is it a different category of its own?"
If Penn & Teller and Derren Brown nothing to do with street magic or close up just skip it because from my point of view had the value.

Street Magic, the stage take place in street?
TV Magic, the stage take place in TV?
Camera Magic, the stage capture by camera [This camera record video or image?]

New genre, TV Magic or Cemera Magic?
Who can answer is the hero meh? Just share the point of view.
Am I misleading myself or you misleading yourself?

I just give my point of view. Aiiii~, take me 6 cigrettes finished.... :(
Interesting question.

Jeuze,

I'm taking time to try to understand your posts.
Thats why I read it a few times over again, but I'm not sure of the relevance of Penn & Teller.

I've never watched Derren Brown perform, they don't have it on TV or Astro so I've no access to it. From what I know, he's a great mentalist. Is he a street magician? This someone has to tell me as I've never seen him perform. From what I've read about him, he doesnt even want to be classified as a magician, let alone street magician.

I didnt ask about Cyril or Blaine or Criss. I know they do perform on the streets.

How do you do that?

Street magic to me is not abt earning money. I dont expect to earn money from doing street magic. I do it coz i love it.. coz i love to see people being entertained by the my magic.

By starting off as a street magician, u gain exposure and experience, talking and communicating with people. Builds up ur confidence and hides away your shyness.

Most great magicians I know start off in the streets. Not all of them televised or even record thier performances. They do it initially coz they love magic, not searching for money.

It is only when they become good and become a big name in restaurants or in the busy streets (people talk abt it.. word of mouth... and this spread fast) where the magician may think hey... people like me.. people enjoy my magic. It is then when the magician would think "hey.. i can do something great with my magic"

That is when this magician would try his luck on cafes, or restaurants.. performs to the manager there... impress him and create a joyful and entertaining seen, catch attention, get cheers from the crowd of the restaurant. The restaurant manager then would hire the magician.

Credibility and fame builts... street magician becomes a performer... earns money...

I love watching and hearing Bill Malone's advice on this. For those who wants a carreer or start or ready for restaurant magic, Bill Malone's On the Loose DVDs are highly recommended. Awesome magic with humour and awesome advice.

Cheers,
Brendan

Let us clear this point once and for all.

If you guys want to enjoy magic WITHOUT any intention of going professional - go ahead and do street magic or even mamak magic - enjoy the time making people happy - thats fine with me.

BUT if a person have an intention to make it as a professional - then it is a different story all together.

You can become a pro just by making enough money every month to meet expenses. You can also become a Pro making some money sometimes and no money most of the time.

You can become a pro and be labelled as a kiddie performer, a clown performer with little bit of magic - or a corporate performer doing annual dinner shows or a royalty performer doing high end shows to royal families.

A pro can be either any of the above. But are they the same.

The market has changed - what works in the past will not work now. What works in USA will not work in M'sia and what works in M'sia will not work in China, or USA or UK. The market is very harsh now - you will also experience the challenges of not being able to collect your performance fees and other problems such as other entertainers sabotaging you. This is the realities of being in business and not only as a pro-magician.

Do you guys really know in detail the personal lives, challenges and hardships the pros go through? Do you guys know that wrong marketing positioning in show business will not allow them to climb the ladder of success in the entertainment industry. Don't simply quote that you know these guys personally to the point of really understanding how pro-life is.

How many real Pros have opened up their personal lives to you guys - pouring out their experiences to you?


CONCLUSION -

If you do not have an intention of being a pro - go enjoy your magic - enjoying entertaining people is Ok - making people happy is OK . Yes - do whatever that pleases you.

But if you do have an intention of being a pro - then rethink my contribution.

A lot of Pros come to me for help because of wrong market positioning - this has nothing to do with magic but the business of business.

There are two issues we are discussing here.

Not being a pro - do what you like

Want to be a pro - do not walk the costly path of mistakes others have experienced.

I am contributing on the various points that need to be taken into consideration because I noticed (through personal conversation with them during teh tariks, email and PMs) that some of you want to be a pro somewhere later in life.

For those of you that have no interest in being a Pro - please allow those that want to be a pro the chance to avoid the costly learning curves.

FINAL POINT -

I am not here to make you guys like me. I am not here to gain support and sell things to the members here. No - I am here to contribute and if the willingness to excel in the TOTAL ART FORM IN MAGIC is not seen - I might as well put my time to another group of people.

I am seasoned by the market. It does not matter whether people like me or not - I only want to enjoy the art of magic with individuals wanting to excel in every way.

Only by being stern and firm in my principle of teaching and learning will individuals excel in magic. Read the previous post somewhere in this forum on how many people I have trained.

I believe I have made my point.

Thanks for sharing with us ya thoughts.

I wish all those of you who wants to be pro oneday all the best.

Its a good idea to talk to James if u are interested in becoming Pro. I believe James does have some good and bad experience to share with you regarding life as a pro.

Its not easy.. but its possible to be a successful magician in Malaysia.... i guess u just need to seek for good advice and some connection to make you a"somebody" in the pro magic world.

My only advice is.... dont give up studies for magic...

A magician i look up to is JC Sum.... as he shared and gave good advice to a few of us during the show in Feb. He is surely a succesful magician. Well spoken, has confidence, and does a great show, v good showmanship... on streets or with his illusions or mentalism on stage.

Jeff Gan,

Derren Brown look like psychologist then magician on his show. His card magic are very good [refer to Devil's Picturebook].

A magic video [there is a number of magic and cannot be one show one magic]
Most derren brown show take place on street. [e.g. Derren ask a spectator think of an action, Derren and spectator position back to back derren cannot see the spectator, Derren write down the action on a piece of paper while the spectator thinking and Derren show the paper to the audience ask the spectator what is he/she thinking the spectator said jumping and the word derren wrote in the paper "jumping". This is mentalism or street magic? or Derren do this show so is memtalism, what if Blaine do this show then this magic is streetmagic?

Penn & Teller: Off the Deep End
Like I said a magic video [a number of magic not only one.]
The video consist underwater magic, close up. [I don't know the name of the magic, they ask spectator select a bait, vanish a bait and appear somewhere else]


Brendan,

Do you mean that you doing magic on street not asking spectator money. This point of view I deeply agree. What if I tape or cam your show and sell it off? Do you want me paid you copyright fees.

[Brendan nothing to do with you, in below sentence, just my opinion]
Imagine that how much time you pratice on that magic. You cannot use money to buy back your time. The more money you can get using money mean your magic worth that kind of money [please don't confuse the highest price you set and you have the value because if you magic is the most expensive but no one is buying you cannot get nothing means that your value is 0].

U are right... i think no street magicians here ask for money on the streets. looks damn st*p*d. LOL

Doing doing tricks on street magic for fun and doing tricks on street for the sake of recording and SELLING ya show off is a different thing. U mean like David Blaine? If i was to do that... its my property the footage. So yeah... definitely if was to be like Blaine... there's a fee and copyright.

JEUZE... im talking street magic here... collecting money on streets? NO No for me.

Ive been paid for gigs, given angpow from stranger in a restaurant during CNY, etc etc on other performances... but not on streets. I think u got me wrong... Everyone would love to get paid for the time and effort they put into practice. There are other places and other events to earn ya money back. Eg. restaurants, company functions etc... but streets... its u wanting to perform not people asking u to perform... get wat i mean? i would LMAO if i see a street magician asking for money on the streets.

Yes, ive invested muc time and money on magic .. and no way wat i earn by doing magic will ever cover that.. by hey... im a working professional as well... so not all my money comes from magic. Magic money is extra blessings I get doing wat i love.