Hello there.

I am from KL. A Non-magician.
Glad to join this forum for sharing magic.

yeah!
new but helps me a lot!

What is a non-magician doing in a magician's forum?
I'm not being rude but you're not being polite either by joining something you're not affiliated to.

First of all support malaysia forum.

Second, in order knowing the road to be a magician, I will go the other way round hope can be a non-magician [an audience].

Third, have you see a magic show without an audience?

Forth, i think this forum full of magician, so i want to be this forum first audience.

I belief in magic [I am an audience], do you belief in magic mindfreak?

Sometime it is really hard make people belief in magic.
:) well anyway joking and hope you understand what i think.

This is for magicians. We come here to discuss magic. Its not a forum for audiences. I'm very sorry to hear your misunderstanding of the concept of magic. Magic is a secret art. It'll take me ages to explain. If you believe in magic, you shouldnt be here in the first place.

I guess u two know each other is it?

tenkaikool, why not take up the art of magic since u got a lot of sources for it? Maybe once u're a magician, u will learn to appreciate the art more.

I just feel that only magicians should know and have resource to magic. If magic secrets can be available to non-magicians its not so magical anymore.

Tenkaikool, im not chasing u out of this place, just as long as you appreciate the art more and not share what you have so widely as though magic is FREE.

Hope u understand

erm, non magician in a magic forum

a bit the like a guy in a female only forum

extreme a bit .. guy in girl toilet ...

i think we r not chasing u out .. but there is a place for everything
like guy belong to guy toilet n girl belong to girl toilet :D
if u r serious, pick up some traning video from web n learn a bit 1st b4 posting

if u need ppl to guide in magic, PM me or some of the mod
they will b more then willing intro u training video to purchase
:D :D :D

God bless
Isaac

tenkaikool

firstly welcome to the MMF. :)

why do you say you're a non-magician? Do you mean Non-professional magician, amatuer magician or hobbyist magician? Do you mean you do not perform publicly?
I'm a hobbyist too, perform only sometimes, mostly for friends, rarely for public.
If you love magic (i'm sue you do, otherwise you wont be in this forum), I hope you find more enjoyment in performing rather than just learning. Come to the gathering this 14th of January and lepak with us, and you'll see what i mean.

I still an audience but enjoy chating with magician.

its ok ,
i believe we all magician oways forgot the laymen inside all of us..

since only one fella here, ok la..
we oways tend to over concious...can see ar? can see ar?
so. mr laymen.. thanks and welcome..
hope u can not just chat but contribute to the magic community in malaysia...]
like wat u think, how certain effect should look nice.. or u got some crazy i dea for us like can we split our body in half without boxes...
good luck

Ofcouse you guy can split body in half without boxes...
joining them[The body] back is the problem[without scar].
I am seeking advice from surgery doctor.
Joking...Reflection solve the problem??

I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, tenkaikool. Magic IS secret art, and this forum is for the people who practice that secret art. The working of the magic is NOT supposed to be known to the audience, so what are you saying?

Sorry if this comes out wrong, but I don't know what you're talking about, so please elaborate more. If you truly are just an audience, I'm sorry but we don't need you here. This is a magicians only place.

If you're an audience you should just be a guest and not a member tenkaikool.
It hurts our ego to have a non-magician dicussing about magic when u urself r not doing magic. Most people here sacrifice time, money & effort to know what they know now. Have you?
I'm not chasing u out either. Welcome! May I suggest u give the art a try instead of just knowing about them and then u might understand what we're talking about and why some of us feel uncomfortable 'bout this issue. Maybe we all should encourage tenkaikool to learn & practice magic instead of chasing away.

This is a good article to read about "Evolving Magic" by Shaman.

Exposure is literally slowing down the entire evolution of the magical art.

I know it's a strong statement, but it is actually true. Given the information age that we are in, exposure is no longer one magician lending a book to another or exposing a trick in a phone conversation - it is much more than that. Within minutes, a brand new trick can be exposed on a website, in a forum, or sent off to hundreds of people through a single email message.

I know that many people will talk about lost sales and improper credit. While those are definitely terrible side effects of exposure, it is really much, much worse than that. Exposure is causing many creators to keep their wonderful magic to themselves. I personally know many top performers who have a "spectator only" show that has some incredible magic and a "magician is in the crowd" show that contains mostly "classic material." I also know of many truly wonderful effects that are absolutely incredible (and I'm fortunate to be able to perform a few of them), but these tricks will never see the open market simply because the creator doesn't want to see it ripped off on a forum or exposure site.

This is where we're really having the main problem - magic is not being produced or shared because of the fear of exposure. This means that you are missing out on a lot of fantastic tricks because other people expose tricks. If you have ever exposed a trick, then you're causing your own evolution to be impeded. The creators of quality magic are quite rare and if exposure continues at this rate, then the well of new magic will be fairly dry in the coming years.

Many people feel that the creators are simply being greedy and want everyone's money. I believe that they have earned it. I have personally worked with some of them on their tricks and have seen months and years of work being put into something they want to completely perfect and sell for 20 bucks. Many pre-production talks involve how to combat exposure. This means that creators are working on preventing their work from being exposed, rather than improving the trick itself.

In an art form where we feel a tight, closely-knit community, why do we do this to our own brothers and sisters? I'm not sure. Maybe it's because the creators are not personal friends of ours and simply a "name on the package." Maybe it's because people feel that the "trick was too simple and they could have figured it out anyway on their own." Maybe it's because people don't realize how difficult it is to create a new magic trick from nothing, master it, perform it enough to work out all of the bugs, and then literally create a training tool for that trick from nothing. Whatever the reason is, we're all accountable for our own actions.

I have some personal tricks that I absolutely love. These were passed down to me from some of the highest regarded magicians involved in the art. This material has not been published and it will never be published and the primary reason for that is exposure. I get questions all the time about people asking how "so and so does this trick" or how "so and so does that trick." The reason that these tricks are not published is because magicians simply cannot be trusted anymore to keep the secret to themselves.

Take a look at a recent levitation that was released. It was a complete rip-off of another levitation that wasn't released. In this case, the creator's idea was literally stolen and he was beat to the punch for taking the trick to the market. I was in shock when I heard about this.

Forget about what's legal/illegal. Forget about what's ethical/unethical. Forget about what's been done before. Instead, ask yourself how you want to be remembered in your own mind. Remember that it's more about doing what's right, than doing what's easier.

Personally, when I come across someone that I find is needlessly exposing or trading for tricks, I make that my last point of contact with them. Many magicians have asked why I no longer return their calls or emails - even some regular professionals. I politely and respectfully indicate that I do not wish to associate with magicians who follow that path. I do not try to change anyone, as that is their own personal choice. Instead, I make the choice of who I will and will not be around.

I am not trying to completely eliminate exposure, as I'm sure it will always be there. Instead, I'm simply trying to let you all know that it might help out in the short term, but it definitely causes much more damage in the long term.

The next time you're put into a situation like this, ask yourself which path will help evolve magic and which path will not. That can be your guide, better than nothing else.

The Shaman

Bill post just say it all. thks for putting up. :D :D

nice article.. looks like Bill is the big fan of The Shaman. :P

or.. u're Bill The Shaman... :!!: :!!: